Posts by Marvin Shilmer

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

I can make any assertion I want. YOU can't do anything about.

Of course you can make any assertion you want. Oh, and I can do something about it. I can ask that you prove your assertion true. I've done that in this discussion with one of your assertions. You could not prove your assertion true. So you made up some obfuscation instead.

Why not lash out at some of the assertions that people made in this thread? Because if you did you would be warring with daddy. You don't want that.

I don't know exactly who or what you're talking about, perhaps Simon. I don't know. In various ways in this discussion I have asked various participants to evidence claims they've made. Some have ponied up and some have not been able to. In most cases things boil down to disagreement about how different participants perceive behaviors at issue in the McKinney incident, and I'm completely okay with that and take no exception to it. But then we have someone like you that takes it upon himself to lay a specific accusation onto someone (me in this case) that is patently false and when asked to prove it and finding you can't you spew ad hominem. I hope it makes you feel better, but it is nonsense nevertheless.

As for Simon, he and I are not exactly buddies. When we disagree I don't hold back my view. Does that align with your latest innuendo of my person? Maybe you should do a little more research on that one.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

COPS is a horrible basis to use for anything.

Not when it contradicts the very thing suggested in full living color. Otherwise I wholly agree with you. Perhaps the person who said what they said should have spoken more precisely.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

Marvin, let me restate that. You started this thread with the hopes it would go where you wanted it to go. The other two people just took it there. That is your Mode of Operation.

That is the kind of complete nonsense I hate in Watchtower and when I see it in others I call them out for it too!

I started this thread to have a decent adult discussion of a current news item. I did not start this thread to suggest anything about race. But then you come along and sling an accusation on my person asserting that I brought a racial element into this.

So what do you do when asked to prove what you say? You make up crap like the above suggesting, basically, NOTHING, except a negative innuendo of a supposed MO. People who make assertions have a burden to prove those assertions true, not to spew ambiguity and innuendo.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

If the race roles were reversed and there was a 200 lb. black cop with both his knees in the back of "lil Becky Sue" you guys would be screaming bloody murder for his arrest and crooning incessantly about how unprofessional his actions were.

On occasion I've watched a television reality show titled Cops. To me this is one of true reality shows.

Here's what I saw repeatedly:

People of every race and gender who acted badly met stiff confrontation from responding law enforcement personnel. I've seen it happen to white and black "Becky Sues". If you behave badly and act contrary to reasonable instructions from the police the likely outcome is getting handcuffed at least. If you don't immediately comply to the handcuffing then force will be met with force until you're the one with the knee in your back. I finally stopped watching the show because it was the same scene over and over again, no matter the city, no matter the race and no matter the gender.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

YOU and two others made this THREAD a race-based thread.

There you go again. Please show me where I've raised race as an element of this incident. Can you do that?

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

Do you realize that you and violas and Marvin are the only ones for the first 4 pages who brought the racial elementinto this?

Please show me where I raised race as an element. Can you do that?

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

It's sad that young kids have to exposed to such treatment so young.

I winced when I heard the bikini gal crying that she wanted her momma. But you know what? She should have listened to the officer and followed his instruction to disperse. It would have taken her only a few seconds to do that. But what does she do? She meanders around. Takes forever. Has to be instructed to leave multiple times. Then when she has nearly left the scene what does she do? She turns around and starts walking right back to the scene.

I'm sorry that she found herself in a harsh circumstance reduced to crying for her momma. But she was asking for a dose of reality and she got it. Based on how she responded to authority in this instance, my best guess is that her momma failed to give her reality lessons earlier in life. Now she's got a dose, and I have news for her. I don't care what color your skin in, or what your nationality is, or what you gender is, life is full of cold hard realities for 99.99 percent of earth's human population. We cannot live in a self-centered world and expect everyone to just put up with us no matter the circumstance. Police officers are not social workers and they are not baby sitters. When someone asks for their presence on the emergency line they respond accordingly for public safety. If nothing else, the bikini gal should have just shut up. But, no. She just could not do it. Then she met a harsh reality that everything is not about her. And she cried for momma. I hope she does that some more, and I hope this time she does it in momma's direct and immediate presence so this time momma can hopefully offer her some good advice and help her realize there are consequences to actions no matter who we are.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

However with respect to how the officer escalated the event we can surely conclude that the outcome was in spite of the officers actions, and not because of them.

Maybe, maybe not. And there lay the conundrum. The officer at issue was one of several, and all of them looked busy to me. They were running one way, then another. There were people everywhere, several of which were blatantly ignoring requests by policy to leave or sit down. Oh, and any one of these individuals could have been packing a weapon, something law enforcement is well aware of.

Remember the bikini gal? Watch her in the video. How many times did she have to be instructed to leave? How long does it take someone to leave the scene? Why does she find it necessary to start walking back toward the scene? What is wrong with this gal? If she does not want to be confronted by police then she needs to stop confronting the police and just leave.

So did this scene end well in part because of this officers actions, or despite his actions. I can't say for sure and no one can. What I can say is that based purely on the video I don't find his actions particularly disturbing. More disturbing to me is what the misbehavior of those teens and adults tells me about the society we live in today. It's no wonder people want to have gated communities!!! It's no wonder people are getting fed up. Where are the parents? The police office at issue is not the one who started this thing. He was called to help mop up behind someone else who started a melee. This is the kind of crap we're thrusting our police officers into the middle of, and it's only getting worse because of population density.

Clue: If a police officer says sit down then SIT DOWN.

Another clue: If a police officer says leave the scene then BACK OFF. Keep your camera rolling if you have one. But BACK OFF.

Law enforcement is not called to the scene to babysit whinny "I-want-my-momma!" teenagers. Law enforcement is called to a scene to maintain safety and keep order.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

If you review the video again you'll see that when the officer turn towards the boy that ran up to him the boy quickly starts to back off ...

Watch the video in real time. This cop was reacting. He was not analyzing and choosing a course. When he felt his personal space being invaded by someone other than a uniformed officer he reacted immediately to preserve his own safety.

305

McKinney Texas pool party?

by Marvin Shilmer in

so today i was asked my thoughts on the pool party incident in mcminney, texas.

my response: it shows a clash of expectations.

i saw police officers who expected citizens to listen to and follow instructions.

Marvin Shilmer

So is assuming that because of that rabid officers actions, there was a safe outcome where everyone went home alive.

No assumptions from me on that point. I'm sure the same end result could have been achieved by an infinite number of sequences of actions. We just happen to know part of the sequence in this case (the part videoed) and we know the outcome was that no one was seriously injured of killed.

I'll add that, based strictly on the video, I was impressed that the officer reacted as quickly as he did to an immediate threat approaching him from behind. I was particularly impressed that his reaction had him pull his gun yet apparently never place his finger on the trigger. He didn't have time to analyze anything. He only had time to react. He reacted to preserve his safety, yet to also refrain from the next step before firing a round, which is placing one's finger onto the trigger.